by Geoff Hoff

Robert Moskowitz hates to see empty seats in any theatre and wants to do something about it. He has thought about it a lot and the idea he has come up with is a theatre co-op, an organization designed, in theory, to relieve individual small theatres in Los Angeles of the need to put their energy into the marketing of their productions.  He’s not a producer, his connection to local theatre is as an audience member. His background is in marketing, public relations, real estate and book publishing. (He is the author of several books, including How To Organize Your Work and Your Life, published by Doubleday.)

Besides simply a marketing co-op, his vision is no smaller than to change the culture of Los Angeles. “When you go to New York, you have to go to theatre,” he said, “and yet, we have a lot more theatre than New York. The actors all live here. You know, we’re doing great theatre work but when you come to LA, you don’t have to go to the theatre. Why not?”

It’s a very good question. And he has not only an answer to the question, but an idea about how to make the change happen. With a theatre co-op in Los Angeles, the money could be spent on advertising and promotion, beginning to drive the idea home to tourists to our area. Not that it could happen overnight. “It would obviously take more than a short amount of time,” he says, “it might take ten years. But that’s something that the theatre co-op could do, to kind of change the perception of LA into a theatre town so that when people come to LA, part of what you do is you go to the theatre.”

It is a very large vision, but, he says, he’s not at all worried about being able to turn it into reality. He’s “one hundred percent confident” that he can do it. The co-op is, to use his word, “imaginary” at this point. He has made several presentations to theatre groups and people involved in the theatre community in Los Angeles. He contacted me to get my thoughts. I was intrigued enough to interview him. What follows are excepts of our lengthy conversation.

LATR - When we chatted briefly at the beginning of the year, you had said that the theatre co-op doesn’t exist, yet. What state it is in now?

Moskowitz - It’s still imaginary. I mean I’ve done a lot of thinking about it and I’ve worked out some of the details of how it would be implemented but I haven’t gotten to the point of actually asking theatre companies to join and I haven’t had any theatre companies say that they want to join. And the theatre co-op is not actually doing anything so it’s still theoretical. But it’s ready to go as soon as we can put some people together and get a critical mass of theatres up and running, then it can start working.

LATR - How would it be structured?

Moskowitz - It’s a voluntary association of independent theatres and it provides kind of an overlay of a marketing arm, primarily. And then it also does other things that no individual theatre can do for itself. And aside from the functions that the co-op does, it does not interfere with anything that the theatre does. Except it probably eliminates their need to do any marketing. We simply provide marketing expertise and energy that they can use to increase the size of their audience. And it’s a synergistic kind of thing.

You know, I’ve gone to a lot of theatre in LA, and sometimes when I go to a theatre, that theatre will market to me afterwards. Most of the time, they don’t. And they almost never market for other theatres, so if I go to theatre “A”, maybe theatre “A” will tell me what else is going on at theatre “A”, but they will never tell me what’s going on in theatres “B”, “C”, “D”, “E” and “F”.

Your best prospects for selling tickets are people who go to the theatre already. So, if I go to theatre “A”, when I buy a ticket, I am already an excellent prospect for theatre “B”, “C”, “D”, “E”, “F” and “G”. So why aren’t they marketing to me? Well, they’re not because there’s no theatre co-op.

LATR - How would the co-op change that?

Moskowitz - The theatre co-op would kind of conglomerate the mailing list of people who attend any theatre, at any member theatre, you know ultimately, we’d like to have 200 member theatres so that every theatre is a member, and anybody who goes to any theatre is automatically a prospect for us to market to. The theory is, the idea is, the goal is, if you go to any theatre, see any play at a member theatre, you are automatically and continuously informed of all other plays that are going on at member theatres. And there’s a lot of ways to do this. One of the ways is a mailing list. And I think that’s cheap and easy and that would certainly be one of the first steps.

Another way is an information center in each lobby. In the beginning, when funds are relatively scarce, that might be a bulletin board, or a poster or a free standing easel. But later on, it would be a computerized kiosk that does a couple of things. The first thing it does is, it has a video thing going on so it’s attracting people.  And it’s attracting people to sign up for the mailing list. And it’s also pushing out information about the various plays that are on at the various theatres. And it does that by showing excerpts from the theatres. And does that by having displays, poster sort of displays fill the screen for each play. And it’s also an interactive kiosk so if you’re interested in seeing a certain actor, or if you’re interested in comedies, if you’re interested in a certain date and time, you can find out what’s available and what’s interesting that meets your parameters within the co-op membership.

So that’s one of the primary things that the co-op would do, would be to inform current theatre goers about other plays. And then, another thing the do-op would do is try to get more people to come to plays.  The co-op would have programs that would market to me as an existing theatre goer and would encourage me to bring my friends. Then, I’m bringing more people into the theatre, people who wouldn’t ordinarily go, and some of them will stick and continue to buy tickets and they would bring their friends.

LATR - You’ve obviously been thinking about this for a long time. What was the germ for this idea, do you remember?

Moskowitz - Well I’m a marketing kind of guy and I went to a lot of theatre. I would be the only person in the audience. Literally, I would go to a play and my wife and I would be the only two people in the audience. And I’d say to myself, this is nuts. You know, why don’t they have more people? Well, one of the reasons is that they never asked more people to come because they never marketed to them.

LATR - They’re artists, they’re not marketers.

Moskowitz - Yeah, exactly. And why should they market? They’re artists. Why should they be involved with that? It’s really unfair to demand that a theatrical impresario or genius or person who really loves to do theatre get involved with the messy business of bringing in an audience. That’s not really what they’re interested in doing, they’re not good at it and as a matter of fact, they don’t do it. So, wouldn’t it be great to have a team that’s dedicated to do nothing but bring in audiences serving the theatre community? So that’s where the theatre co-op idea came from.

LATR - What has stopped you from actually implementing it?

Moskowitz - I don’t know. It’s some sort of negative field that exists. I have spoken to at least thirty different theatre makers and talked about my idea and uniformly they say it’s a great idea. But somehow it just cannot translate to a level of action. And I don’t really know why that is. One person who’s very knowledgeable in LA Theatre has told me that there’s a sort of a gun shy attitude. These people have been lied to, taken advantage of, had money taken away from them. In so many different ways, so many people have promised the moon and delivered nothing that they’re just unwilling to take another chance. And that may even be true.

And I think that, another thing, they’re very, very busy. They’re already stretched very thing, so any hint that they might have to do something else is really a big turnoff for them. And I have been carefully talking about the co-op, trying to use terminology and concepts to indicate that they’re not going to have to do anything, because that’s how the co-op is conceived in my mind. The theatre doesn’t have to do anything different. Just all that happens is more people walk in the door. But I think that’s a very difficult message to convey. I think I’m at the stage now where I’m thinking the only viable way to really start this thing is to get some of of a grant or some sort of an angel backer and actually pay theatres to join. If I say, if you join the co-op you’re going to get a check every month, you know, a hundred dollars or five hundred dollars or a thousand dollars, I think I might get a little more attention.

LATR - Do you have any contact with possible angel backing for that?

Moskowitz - No. I think there probably is grant money available for that. And I’m a half an inch away from starting the whole process of going after grants. I have beaten my head against this wall for such a long time I’m pretty convinced it’s not going to start if it’s income neutral or cash neutral. I think my last best chance to get this thing off the ground is to actually pay. So that’s what my thinking is at this moment.

LATR - Your web site (www.TheaterCo-Op.com), obviously, is just sort of a teaser page at this point. One of the things that you say is, provide each member arts organization with an improved web site.

Moskowitz - Yes.

LATR - With the web site that you have, which is basically just text on a green page, it’s not the prettiest thing I’ve ever seen. How would you be able to provide that to your organizations?

Moskowitz - Well, there’s several different ways. I mean, there’s lots of companies that are in the business of providing relatively standardized web pages and stacking them with content. You know, they do they do it for Realtors and they do it for sporting goods stores and they do it for doctors. I happen not to be an expert in web site construction as you can see, but it’s not hard to get that together. So I think probably the way it would go would be some sort of a version of a standardized web site, cloned for each theatre member and customized for each theatre member but basically with relatively standard content. And a room of pages within the web site for each theatre to control or provide its own content. So there would be centralized control of a hundred web sites putting up articles about theatre in LA and transportation in LA and stars coming to LA and the various co-op content that we think theatre goers would be interested in finding out about. But then each theatre would have a little control panel available to themselves and it could control certain segments of its own web site. And it could have day-to-day changes that could indicate, you know, who’s substituting for the featured performer in tonight’s performance.  That’s a very well understood technology and it’s just a question of bucks or trade outs or something to get that going.

LATR - A lot of them have very good web sites. Some of them don’t but most of them at least have something up there at this point.

Moskowitz - But they’re spare. There’s not a lot of city-wide content, there’s not a lot of stuff to attract theatre-goers just to browse that site, it’s very specifically a sales site oriented towards the current show and maybe the next one. So why should they even do that if they don’t want to? I mean if they like it, if the theater-maker is very interested in doing web work, that’s fine, go ahead and do it. If that’s something that you can out-source to the co-op, co-op then why shouldn’t there be a co-op capable of taking that job on.

LATR - Do you have any idea about when you’d like something to actually be in place?

Moskowitz - Well I think the theatre co-op is ready to go as soon as there’s a critical mass of theatres willing participate. So, you know, I would not be the source of any delay. If tomorrow you had thirty or forty of your friends who are theatre-makers get together and say, yeah, let’s do a co-op, then by Monday we’d be working with it. That has really been the stumbling block. It’s been very difficult for me, has been impossible for me to get theatre-makers to say, yes, let’s go forward, I’m ready to do it. I’m going to commit. You know, I’ve had lots of meetings, I’ve made lots of presentations, I’ve gotten lots of feedback. And invariably it’s all positive from the theatre-makers. Maybe they’re being polite. And there’s some horrible flaw in my plan that they’re too polite to tell me about. But generally what they say to me is that it’s a good idea and they need it. But then it doesn’t translate into actual action. I don’t know why.

LATR - Have you thought about hiring a web designer to get something so that when people first look at you, they come to something that’s much more inviting?

Moskowitz - Yeah, well, here’s my thinking about that, and it’s very personal.  You know, I have a lot of things going on in my life and I do not want to push myself into the theatre community and create a theatre co-op if it’s not wanted. So if it doesn’t want to fly, I don’t want to drive it. So if the theatre community is not receptive to the idea of the co-op, then that’s fine. You know, I have plenty of other things to do. If this were my main idea for a business and I had a five year plan and I was going to make my income from this, you know, then I would be willing to make investments and create a whole reality of it and hope to bring people in and hope to make it viable, but that’s not really where I’m coming from.

Where I’m coming from is the theatre community is going along, it has been going along and will continue to go along without me and it’s doing the job it’s doing on marketing, and it’s doing its job at doing the other things I think ought to be done, and that’s fine. And I have an idea for doing some of these things in a way that I feel is better. And I’m happy to do that if it is wanted. If it’s not wanted, that’s fine, I’ll do something else. So I’m really unwilling to start investing in a better web site, and paying people to join and all sort of stuff until I get some sort of traction. And there hasn’t been a lot of traction. In a way, the Universe is saying, this is a great idea but nobody wants it so go away. And I am happy to receive that message and stop. That’s where I’m coming from rather than driving this thing into the theatre community whether they want it or not.

As long as it’s getting done, I don’t have to be the one doing it. But I just feel the need for some of these things to get done and they’re not getting done. I’d be happy to do them if the theatre community wants them. And I’d like to [mention] some of the other things the co-op would do beyond the simple marketing things that we’ve talked about.

LATR - Sure. Like what?

Moskowitz - Well, one thing would be a series of conferences, which I think could be money makers for the co-op and the theatres and would be interesting for the theatre-going community and also the theatre-making community. And I think only the co-op, well, primarily the co-op is capable of running these conferences. One series of conferences would be for the theatre-makers. And it would bring together people who are interested in making theatre and they would talk about making theatre. It would be directors, it would be designers, it would be producers. Writers. Talking about the things that are important to them. Sharing ideas, synergizing and all that kind of stuff.

And then that material would be recorded somehow, video taped or maybe just observed by a parallel series of conference among theatre-goers. People who like the theatre and want to know more about it and they would be invited to conferences about upcoming plays and what to look for when you watch a play and who are the top talent, people coming up and, you know, that kind of thing, too, if would be of interest to the theatre-consuming group. And, you know, there’s some cross-over there because some of the things that are interesting to the theatre-consuming group, theatre-going group would be to observe theatre-makers as they’re talking about things that are important to them. Conferences are a well established, well understood industry and they do make money if they’re popular, if people want to go to them.

Another thing that the co-op could do that no real individual theatre could do is kind of change the culture. Because when you go to New York, you have to go to theatre. And yet, we have a lot more theatre than New York. The actors all live here. You know, we’re doing great theatre work but when you come to LA, you don’t have to go to the theatre. Why not? It’s because nobody’s really put that out there. Nobody’s spent the money on advertising and promotion. Nobody’s really driven that idea home among tourists. And that’s something that the theatre co-op could do. It would obviously take more than a short amount of time, it might take ten years. But that’s something that the theatre co-op could do, to kind of change the perception of LA into a theatre town so that when people come to LA, part of what you do is you go to the theatre. And no theatre could do that but the co-op could do that.

So there’s a lot of things along those lines that are long-term promotion of theatre and theatre artists that no individual theatre can really do or afford to do, but that the co-op could do. So it’s a very large vision, and at this point, I’m the only one with it. Well, I shouldn’t say that, that’s not fair. But I haven’t received enough support from the theatre community to actually turn it into reality. And I’m not at all worried about turning it into reality.  I’m one hundred percent confident that everything I’ve talked about, I can do. And not just me, other people know how to do it, too. All that’s needed is some sort of business engine to provide the resources to make it possible. And I see that business engine being an increased audience for theatre.

Lots and lots of tickets are already sold, but there’s lots and lots of empty seats. And once the curtain goes up, those empty seats are worthless. And I think one of the things the co-op could do is fill those seats. And even if they don’t fill all of those seats, the other seats could somehow be used as incentives among business or as trade-outs with other business to get some value from those otherwise empty, wasted seats. And all of those resources that could be realized by doing all this stuff could be used to fund the co-op, to pay more money to the theatres and to do lots of activities that right now there’s no money for.

LATR - Is there anything else that you want to add that we haven’t touched on, yet?

Moskowitz - No, I think you’ve really asked all the pertinent questions and caused me to spit out all the pertinent information. Thanks very much for taking the time to interview me, Geoff.

LATR - Thanks for taking the time to take my call, Mr. Moskowitz.

For more information, go to www.TheaterCo-Op.com or email at info@TheatreCo-Op.com